Re: Weary MMO traveler seeks home...

I will be a beastfolk and likely never be seen on the other two offerings. My husband and I will likely be merchant crafters, nomads, and good Samaritans.

What drew me to this offering? Well, it's basically UO in a better engine with actual, bleeding edge tech that is scale-able as well as mod-able.

Actually, what drew me to this offering was a combination of moments:

• CEO Kickstarter that I could have written. Point by point nailed me as "your audience" from the start.
• The pitch has been backed by iterative updates and examples that show me you're not just talk and delayed dates.
• The way that your lead designer nods as your CEO speaks; the way that your CEO listens to the point of forgetting to look at the camera (which means he's verifying his own information and changing it if needed... team strength epic. It comforts me as an investor and a gamer).
• Sitting with my husband and watching the Kickstarter about an hour ago and watching him go through precisely the reaction I had when I started following you (strategic PR splash was en pointe!).
• Getting his enthusiastic permission to spend what we both know is windfall money on this game because it's the only way I'll have it and I MUST HAVE IT. Heh.

You folks are doing more to advance MMO gaming than anyone in the industry right now... it is not without irony that I say your node implementation is a fraction of Fractured (grin) and your only real competitor doesn't seem to understand you've actually done precisely what the market has asked you to do - give each of us the experience we want and let us PAY YOU RICHLY for being wise enough to do so.

So, yeah. I don't really "fan gran" about things, like, ever.... and other people from other places will quickly point you to placed where I am much less sociable.

This game will fail only by effort, I think. Or if they run out of cash. Which I can't imagine, given the partnership with Improbable. I have loved Improbable long time (since they were pitching city management) and was among those who pointed them at gaming... I like seeing tech that's meant to be together finally meet.

I didn't realize when we sat down today to look at the original presentation that there was actually an alpha coming like, tomorrow.

Karma has been kind. I cannot imagine why, but I'm hella happy to be here (as you can see).

Hello, world.

This game reminds me (and creates in me) a sense of delight that I have not had since Ultima Online. Thank you, @Prometheus for that, even if nothing else (and there's plenty else!).

What matters most to me in MMOs is continuous improvements on supporting levels of social contracting between players. I often feel the genre has stagnated because current design mechanics never seem to make time for deeper social contracting. What I mean by this is having the ability, in the game, to create, commit, and complete contracts. Specifically, in a many-to-many relation so you get layers of potential for emergent styles of player contracting (e.g., economy, trade, supply chain, governance, reputation, etc).

Another reason I want to see this progress for the genre (industry, frankly) is that PvP consistently fails in the genre due to a lack of formality in social contracting (which provide the means by which emergent and informal cultures and systems can develop in the community). Or, as this article succinctly put it, deliver "deliberate accessibility" as well as checks and balances on enforceability to mitigate the kinds of things this article presents.

As CCP has discovered, that 2012 article was pretty spot on, as this more recent admission reveals.

I've never understood why there seems so much resistance to the notion of effectively bridging the abyss created (in error, I assert) by dividing PvE and PvP in the first place. Creating that false premise that it could ever be possible to have a realistic world without realistic systems of social contracting.

To truly elevate the art and science of the MMO, you have to be willing to break it until it's fixed. (Admittedly, this is what the market has been doing for the last 8 years or so, still, few avail themselves of the lessons because, ultimately, most are still married to the idea that it's impossible to accurately reflect real world systems.)

Tools like SpatialOS and savvy analytics now offer the opportunity to offload much of the heavy lifting, AND there are considerable reams of relevant, recent research to assist in refactoring and improving, well, everything. It remains that the more realistic the algorithm, the more realistic the world, and the more likely that emergent uniqueness needed (on SO many levels!) can arise.

So I guess you'd say what matters most to me in an MMO is how well it supports mutually realistic systems of relation, contract, and enforcement.

I mean, why shouldn't PvP players be lauded for protecting the server? Why shouldn't there be crime statistics telling players the reputation of the areas belonging to certain others? Why shouldn't there be war between nations, religions, and beliefs that mean more than who got points on a leaderboard?

For example, I really liked the way Archeage tried to go about it, but the community has lost something important... a reason to care about the community experience unless it directly benefits their personal experience. We're all just... potential targets now. That's not realism... and it's not fun.

I was going to go back and add in more links, but this is already long and most won't care to read such long, nerdy things anyway, I'll not.

((That'll teach you not to ask me an open ended question!!))

Female biped, generally harmless in small doses. Love computers, coffee, cats, my hubby, and of course, gaming.

Started with The Well, MOOs, MUDs, and MUSHes, co-sys's alongside BBS legend Rodney Aloia, got into gaming with Pong. Then a string of games typical of someone calling themselves "highly engaged" - Meridian 59, Ultima Online, Everquest, Asheron's Call, Dark Age of Camelot, W.I.S.H., Shadowbane, World of Warcraft, etc, etc, etc.

Retired, living with a pretty constant chronic pain, so I'm usually posting under the influence of a chronic strain. (sly grin)

Sharing life with a husband, two cats, and as many of you as can put up with me.

Hoping for a shot at a key, but not fooling myself on how able to top 100 that foundation I could possibly be. Still, here until budget and bones permit me to do more than watch from the sidelines.

I missed the Kickstarter, but I'll likely pick up somewhere between Alpha 2 and Beta (if the budget is kind).

So "hello" and [wave] and [friendly noises].... buckling in for the ride!

@therippyone I suspect you did not fully read that last link, but your opinion is interesting to me in that is presumes that it is far more difficult to render real world systems in a game than reality proves it, particularly given SpatialOS.

Additionally, all the theories from economics to sociology to geolocal specific cases/history have academic research and peer-reviewed study. All of these present whatever statistically relevant (i.e., demonstrable causality) findings they're able to support.

The math exists and is validated. The science exists and is peer-reviewed. The technology now exists and, while still young, will only improve.

By way of example, this item from

and even modify variables on the fly to more accurately reflect causal relationships in real world situations.

I know all of this because I was the person who first suggested to them they should get into gaming. City modeling and government sales are great, but slow cycle and not likely to improve. Gaming, on the other hand.... (as we see, they are on it like white on rice now).

Real world systems. In real time simulations. Using real world academic, scientific, and technological data and methods.

It continues to astonish me that companies seeking to realize products that reflect realism completely ignore available academic work (now even including specifically game studies) in favor of an industry preference... dissonance, dis-confirmation bias, et al. I'm happy to see offerings like Fractured and to see Improbable recognizing and reacting to industry need that the industry isn't even willing to acknowledge exist (yet).

You are arguing from a consumer and player's perspective; heavily influenced by previous experiences, heavily bound by its own assumptions on what is and isn't preferred, and projecting that on the market. No judgment here, it's well known this is common on forums (just as the reality of forum posters being exponentially outnumbered by lurkers, and that people will assume agreement in the face of silence when, in fact, the opposite is much more often true).

What I am saying is that, of all, I hope Fractured does NOT represent old design in a new technological shell. That, instead, it provides a world in which realistic systems provide a more realistic experience. A true world simulation that just happens to be a game.

But, to the point (at last, eh?) I'm not speaking merely my opinion when I say change is needed, nor when I say it is now possible; I'm stating that tools like SpatialOS will make our offerings soooo much more interesting. They'll benefit too, of course. There are already huge swaths of industry begging for better data and insight... what better place than in a game world to model such things? (I can even see where data from SpatialOS could be actionable for the creators of Fractured well outside this endeavor.)

I want most to see this level of realism in simulation in MMO offerings.

It is highly unlikely a consumer could come up with a historical gaming scenario that has not been analyzed exhaustively in other academic or scientific contexts.

Finally, finally, finally, the game industry is beginning to realize is that there is a decided benefit (and potentially new lines of revenue) to be had in incorporating academic, scientific data in games via emerging technologies.

So, thank you for the reply, however guileful in derision and dismissal. It remains that I see nothing in your response that in any way negates the work linked... certainly not that effectively rebuts my statements.

/tips hat

@Rofus - I hear you and thank you for the encouragement, but the days when I streamed, had an audience, and a little influence are behind me. Maybe I'll make it on forum presence, but that's not likely until I have something worth saying (i.e., if I'm not testing, how can that be?).

Regardless, thank you to everyone for such a warm welcome.

@Gibbx - I can only hope.

@roccandil said in Pinatas, catatonia, and Montgomery Scott (or what matters the most to me in MMOs):

@ekadzati said in Pinatas, catatonia, and Montgomery Scott (or what matters the most to me in MMOs):

A given collective of players should be able to encode their cultural rules upon the land(s) they manage, and be able to do so in such in a way that assures technology handle the heavy lifting.

Providing the options of different models is the only requisite. How they are used will be the emergent aspect.

Maybe players prefer to follow real world examples, maybe they don't... but it's a lot easier to do any of it if the game itself provides a means of formalizing such things.

I like Fractured's take on planetary cultures; I'm saying with the right systems in place, you wouldn't need separate planets.

So, you'd like to see, say (just for example), a guild alliance structure available to demons on Tartaros? Something that would penalize breaking the alliance or attacking allies (or maybe prevent attacks on allies entirely).

(From a lore perspective, could be a blood oath/magic thing that not even demons ignore lightly.)

@dragomok said in Pinatas, catatonia, and Montgomery Scott (or what matters the most to me in MMOs):

...but then again, even rudimentary modelling ecology leads to mob in-fighting, and OOOHH YES, mob in-fighting can be fun. Firefall beta didn't have a full-blown ecology, but it had mob factions. I liked to herd swarms of Hissers onto Brontodons, and my favourite memory is of a (brief) five-sided players-Raiders-Chosen-Brontodons-wildlife battle that I accidentally started.

That sounds cool. I'd love to see more ecological systems implemented!

Yes to both, actually. Any "agreement" that is possible between players should be able to be formalized (there will always be compelling reasons NOT to do so, but one's reputation over time somewhat implies there is more than anecdotal and highly biased history to refer to... even as there will always be argument around "whose perspective is accurate/correct/factual" - there will be more depth when there is more information and access TO it for players.)

Players never consider the health of the surrounding systems. I think they should. I'd like to, personally, and I think it would give mobs as well as players reasons to regularly check their premise and adjust as needed (i.e., rather than sink into rote behaviors, min-maxing/theorycraft, and "gaming the system").

Anyway, I am about to be on the road a bit, so likely will be sparse on replies unless insomnia visits again. Thanks for the discussion.... very interesting and enjoyable!

Not at all concerned, really. They are less than 10 people pulling off something that I've seen studios of over 200 not manage as well in an early alpha test cycle.

The real shame would be if some tempest in a teacup spun up and randomized them from what has already got to be a crunchy schedule.

Please make a point of viewing things available and reading through released developer diaries and updates. I think you'll agree with me afterward that it's much more about prioritizing their time for maximum output than maximum communication.

(That said, they probably need to get someone for those communications soon because we all know a hype train left unsatisfied quickly turns into a mess.)

#JustMyTwoCents
#IgnoreAtWill

EASK here, but I prefer the more narrowly defined 'motivation' profile I got for free here: https://apps.quanticfoundry.com/surveys/start/gamerprofile/

Mine are: https://quantic.page.link/XF9i1LQ6XyAbdjx28

I hear you. Nheedra (bears) is the plan here. Have a loose guild concept that I'll be building out further once lore is available (may be a while). Until then, testing and trying my best to break things so they don't make it to the live game.

Bigtime PvE, craft, trade, and sometimes (looking around and whispering)... roleplay.

Relevant link: https://fracturedmmo.com/guild-profile/id/4376/

The Yo-Na Commune is a loose association of beastfolk seeking a peaceful mercantile and/or farming experience. Depending upon interest over time, we may grow into a town but our focus is more on shared progress within a larger community than a competitive or exclusionary one.

Husband/Wife founders intend to develop a democratic community within which direction and authority are shared in parity with those who provide the organization and infrastructure to make "fun" for others.

Further direction to be defined as membership and time yields interest. Questions welcome.

Just got the minipatch/update and logged in, attempted to bring a character in to test.

Received a SpatialOS error that made it sound like I didn't get logged in, and the exit process to the error was less than graceful (i.e., "...did not log out fully... may need to wait before trying to log back in...").

System began really grinding to a halt, so I gave it the three-finger salute (as ya do) and was greeted by this lovely task manager window -

Not sure if there are particular logs I should look for to help chase it down or not, but, if so, just let me know.

@Tuoni Nope. Hard pass here. They seem to be nailing all the wrong things for all the wrong reasons.

I predict a resounding silence upon gold, followed by no little amount of clucking internally at AGS, followed by... who knows.

@Stacy555 said in Bartle's Taxonomy and this game.:

Oh dear lord .... a Gamer motivation profile .... damn I'd rather spend my time choosing a hairstyle that looks good in blue.... Motivation profile ... Really ?? ROTFFL !!!!!!

I don't know if you missed the point or just didn't bother to consider it, but there is more than one context at work in this thread, and that's not even the running scene in your head, where this is all about you.

Or, to put it baldly, why could, should, or would it matter what your preference is when I was talking about mine?

Are you one of those people who can't just be comfortable around different perspectives? If so, might I suggest just adding me to your ignore list now and putting us both out of your misery?

Thanks.

For those interested in gamer motivations, the GDC presentations by Yee are really fascinating watching and educational.

For those interested in gaming theory, I'd recommend taking up basic economics and behavioral economics before it, as the gaming industry has a woeful habit of reinventing the wheel as a matter of pride (i.e., engines in particular until very recently)... significantly more insight and relevance is found in economics.

For those interested in how companies go about figuring out "what their product is" and all elements implicit therein, that's called "product management" in the business world, am I'm retired from a career in it. There are significant areas of crossover that could benefit gaming, but the creative/studio model is loathe to accept more structure, even when it offers significant cost avoidance and savings.

Happy to answer any questions and equally so to refer to extensive resources... please don't mistake my courtesy for weakness - if you make a target of me, bring a lunch.

EASK here, but I prefer the more narrowly defined 'motivation' profile I got for free here: https://apps.quanticfoundry.com/surveys/start/gamerprofile/

Mine are: https://quantic.page.link/XF9i1LQ6XyAbdjx28

@Jetah said in [Feedback]: Did content pills get killed by the virus?:

@Ekadzati said in [Feedback]: Did content pills get killed by the virus?:

@Jetah said in [Feedback]: Did content pills get killed by the virus?:

@Ekadzati

I'm just getting tired of having to remind DS that the KS people and updates exist.

you'd think an important event like the free test would be a great time to do a KS update but they didn't.

You don't have to remind them, that's a choice... and every time you make that choice after getting no response from the previous one is wasting your time.

Don't waste your time. Ever. That's all I'm saying.

then no one would play games.

i attempt to remind them so Kickstarter doesn't get a bad reputation (but in the video game segment that may already be tarnished).

If I had as much influence as you seem to expect you will, I'd be doing more than trying to convince gaming developers to communicate with me. (sly grin)

@Jetah said in [Feedback]: Did content pills get killed by the virus?:

@Ekadzati

I'm just getting tired of having to remind DS that the KS people and updates exist.

you'd think an important event like the free test would be a great time to do a KS update but they didn't.

You don't have to remind them, that's a choice... and every time you make that choice after getting no response from the previous one is wasting your time.

Don't waste your time. Ever. That's all I'm saying.

@PeachMcD said in Why this game is not fun:
... and wish I'd been able to find a working enchanter's table in the starter town[/quote]

Hit my place up -2799 W -30N for public tables (all of them) and crafting services. Public chest at front door - take what you can use, leave what you can't.

If not, catch me next go 'round, eh?

@Jetah I hear how you feel. I understand your feelings. I think where we part ways in common thinking is that, even with being flat out told "you will get X", I don't expect "X" until "X" arrives at my feet.

Keeps me from wasting my time on feeling resentment or my energy on "that which is not" as if spending my energy on it will make it "that which is".

No worries, it takes everyone to make the world interesting. /salute

@Salamanderham said in What is the main reason why you want to play Fractured?:

I game that lets me play the way I want. I backed this because it gives me options.

Absolutely. This.

@Jetah I did not say it was new, nor did I imply that being new was some manner of free pass. Frankly, I don't think about things that way because I get they don't really OWE me anything; end of day, this is a donation type investment and if/when an offering doesn't live up to my expectations, I've no one to blame but myself for backing them. (Believe me, I have a string of those to look back on, so that's how/why I get what you mean).

I suppose if you want to think it's sloppy or deliberately or whatever else, that's up to you. I was just trying to give you a different set of possibilities and constructs to help you offset your annoyance. It never occurred to me that you were being grudgeful.... thanks for letting me know. /salute