Posts made by Gothix

What would be wrong with squirrel-kin and bunny-kin?

@lovechildbell we are talking about rock paper scissors system here, not about the mild edge.

Scissors do not just have a mild edge over paper, they beat it, period. So when discussing RPS system, that means its the system were class is beat by anti-class.

And this thread is about schools being balanced. So if the game is made that warfare school is beat hard by conjuration school then that means game sucks major ass.

If attributes are not balanced and INT proves to be too advantageous to magic schools, and player progression who are using those schools, over players that play archers or warriors, than game will suck major ass.

And you can keep talking about how games, moving, running, bla bla,... whatever man, but if RPS gaming becomes reality here, no competitive players will be playing, because RPS system is the system that automatically determines the winner.

If schools are balanced and anyone can win than this is NOT RPS system. And that's what we wish.

People cheering up for inclusion of RPS system are people that can't really play, and they wish to rely on RPS system in order to be able to win on occasion vs their anti classes. Such people should go play something else, and let Fractured be a skill based MMO rather then RPS MMO.

Nuff said.

FibS, the only people that love rock paper scissor systems are unskilled players, that use this system as an excuse for their own lack of skills.

Anti class attacks you and you die, "ooh it's just because he was my anti class". And when you want to kill someone, you go scout out for classes that you can easily kill cus you are their anti class, and then you boost your ego how you killed them because you are skilled hero, lol.

Meanwhile, skilled players are looking for balanced games where SKILLS determine the victor. And they do not play rock paper scissor nonsense.

So go ahead and keep explaining how RPS is good, and then read the first paragraph and think about it a bit.

@FibS it's very simple, you can cheer on for rock paper scissors system, but if it happens you can kiss the pop goodbye, and play on empty server till it dies.

That's all I'm going to say. Have fun.

I really hope that guild membership is changed to full sandbox mode, and that guilds are able to recruit how they like. So people that start off with beasts and plan to go abomination path can instantly play with their friends in demon guilds and not wait an eternity before they can join up, and for various other reasons.

Leaving choice to players, about who they wish to play with is best option, again imho.

@fibs said in Why Magic users will be OP compared to physical users:

@gothix said in Why Magic users will be OP compared to physical users:

No?

Yes.

I guarantee The Secret World is also a rock-paper-scissors game. If it wasn't, it would just be a big numbers game, which is hardly skill-based.

It was not. Whoever didn't play original secret world has effectively missed out on greatest MMO in history of gaming. And now it's shut down and gone forever because kids cried that it was too hard, and rather than bothering to get their skills up, they chosen to cry so that Funcom nerfs it. And secret world got shut down, and secret world Legends was born. Introducing nerfs across the whole game, and cash shop progression system.

This is our sad reality. 10 year old kids everywhere now, running across forums and crying (and many adults like wise), and no MMO is skill based anymore, or even if it starts like that, devs soon fall under pressure of kids crying on forums. Because money is king, and making games "instant gratification" products, brings in more players.

I'm sad you didn't get to try original TSW mate. You have no idea what you have missed out on.

@lovechildbell said in Why Magic users will be OP compared to physical users:

@gothix But you're not limited to schools. Whats the problem with splashing other schools to counter another?

Physically you are not limited to a single school (or 2 schools), but efficiency wise you kinda are, because you will only really be effective in schools that fit in with attributes you have selected on start and that you can't change during game play.

This is why this thread was started in the first place, because INT stat seemed too beneficial compared to other stats (benefits beyond spell efficiencies with affiliated magic schools - learning / progression speed). This concern had me start this thread in the first place.

This thread is discussion thread, hoping to bring attention to possible issues that were mentioned, issues that could come out of one particular stat (namely INT here) bringing more benefits to a player then other stats, working in favor of players focusing on particular schools being favored over players focusing on other schools.

Hopefully you understand an issue now, and the point of this thread.

@savvym said in World affairs:

they mentioned many times that experienced players will be only slightly stronger than the new comers

This only goes for gear / stat power.

Skills are completely different story, someone who is skilled will easily beat someone who is not skilled. This further means that guilds that will recruit full force of pro skilled people could easily dominate other guilds that will recruit less skilled people and play differently. They will dominate with skills, not with gear.

Will certain guild dominate an area? Sure, if that guild recruits most skilled people on the server, while other guilds do not, yeah that guild will easily dominate, and this is how it is supposed to be. So if you run a guild, care about your recruitment.

@lovechildbell as long as you can find stuff in one school that can work vs stuff from other school (while re working your deck) that's good. The point is that any school has stuff that can work vs any other school, and it will all depend on what you currently have in your deck.

Once the game would design particular school that has such deck that other particular school has NOTHING IN ENTIRE SCHOOL to be viable against that, and that school becomes perma scissors vs rock vs other school, THAT is bad.

Decks do not need to be balanced (it is impossible to balance out each individual deck), but SCHOOLS overall need to be balanced to each other.

I want to hear their vacation stories how they seduced hot chicks and then start to tell them about Fractured. I wanna hear how that ended up.

@FibS if you actually read what I wrote you would see that I am not against having a particular skill be counter to another skill. I am against a particular school be a counter to another school.

When I say game being rock paper scissors, I mean particular school being paper, while another school being scissors. As long as there is a build within each school who can be viable against builds from other schools that is ok. As I wrote, schools need to be balanced between each other, not particular decks.

See a comment I wrote you in other thread where I used example of original TSW.

@fibs said in Why Magic users will be OP compared to physical users:

all skill-based games are rock paper scissors, have fun with no games

No?

An amazing example of skill based, classless game that was amazingly well balanced regardless of what weapons you were using was original The Secret World (if you didn't play TSW, lets just simplify and say that weapons were the "classes" there, your current deck was tied to the weapon you were using at given moment).

Even if you were free to created so many permutations of decks, each weapon was generally balanced to any other weapon, and it was only up to you how good deck you were able to theory craft and apply. But best decks out there for any weapon were all balanced to each other, and you could do equally well using shotgun or elemental focus, for example.

No game, to this day, has matched TSW in deck building, mechanic complexity, theory crafting, and in skills and brain being so much more important than gear you were using (people in full blue could perform literally 500% than people in full epic, if they were smarter and more skilled).

Every game out there should look up to (original / not Legends) TSW when designing their skill trees and mechanics.

__

There are other good examples with good MMOs not being rock / paper / scissors, but this one will suffice since it is THE best example.

And if you question if TSW was skill based, just ask around learning curve was so steep that zerg of people gave up on game because it was simply too hard / it leaned on skill requirements way too much, and not many could efficiently play it (people got completely destroyed even by trash animals in forests). This is one of the reasons why Funcom created Legends TSW (complete game redesign, read SEVERE nerf to game complexity) in hopes they would attract wider player population (read kiddos with lesser skills).

So please do not use statements such as (all skill-based games are rock paper scissors) if you only ever played few MMOs in your life, because if you played more decent amount, you would certainly see that there are a few that aren't.

__

And if you wonder why am I not in TSW then. It's because Funcom completely shut down developing future content to original TSW, and are only working on TSW Legends now (completely nerfed version of the game). If original TSW was still alive, I would still be there (I have lifetime subscription).

FK countries, I'm from planet Earth.

@Dybuk there are no classes but there are primary attributes that are unchangeable after you select them on start, and each attribute is better fitting to certain school.

This is why schools of magic should be balanced between each other.

So perhaps we shouldn't be saying a "mage" should be balanced with "warrior", but what we actually mean by this is that "conjuration school" should be balanced with "warfare school" etc. Schools are the ones that need to be balanced (and thus benefits that particular attributes bring as well, and not for example INT giving more benefits than PER), so any school is viable vs any school, so that schools do not end up being "rock paper scissor" to each other, because if that will be the case, then game will majorly suck.

@lovechildbell said in Why Magic users will be OP compared to physical users:

@logain in a game of rock paper scissors which one is "best"

If game will be rock paper scissors, I, and many others, will be out of here faster than you can say rock.

@gothix said in NO tank mages:

There are no classes but there are primary attributes that are unchangeable after you select them on start, and each attribute is better fitting to certain school.

This is why schools of magic should be balanced between each other.

So perhaps we shouldn't be saying a "mage" should be balanced with "warrior", but what we actually mean by this is that "conjuration school" should be balanced with "warfare school" etc. Schools are the ones that need to be balanced (and thus benefits that particular attributes bring as well, and not for example INT giving more benefits than PER), so any school is viable vs any school, so that schools do not end up being "rock paper scissor" to each other, because if that will be the case, then game will majorly suck.

@evolgrinz said in Allergy to various types of food.:

Might as well ass phobias into the game too then. Getting paralyzed when seeing spiders. Afraid of water and you can't walk through water, no matter how deep. Get random fear debuff where you run around with no ability to control yourself during night, because the fear of the dark.

What about claustrophobia, you can build your house, but you can never enter it.

I personally extremely dislike rock paper scissors system. I much prefer where all classes are balanced and viable vs any other class.

Otherwise when you meet someone out in the wilds, even before battle starts you would already know who the winner will be. People would chase classes that they beat, and run away from their "anti classes". It's a very dull way to play.

No rock paper scissors system please.

PS: I was following Ashes of Creation with interest for a while, until i saw all the bad choices they were making, but the last drop was announcement of rock paper scissors system. When I saw they announced that, I left and never looked back.

@ryatsuga on Tartaros you will be able to collect animal bones.

For all of you that plan to play mages and use an argument "you have to still do tasks in game to learn skill" and such..

OK lets just change knowledge learning dependence from INT to PER. I guess since "you still need to do tasks in game" you will not mind this right?

Cool, I though so.

How about plastic surgery to enlarge our boobs?

Oh wait, isn't this "that" kind of thread? Sorry, my bad...