Posts made by Phaethonas

@target said in Feature Spotlight #6 - PvP, Alignment & Crime:

@phaethonas I agree with your general sentiment, but I doubt Tartaros can be characterized as the poor planet.

Well, when I read the following I get the feeling that it will be the "poor planet".

Tartaros is the smallest of all the planets of the Elysium Ring. Notwithstanding its size, its walkable surface is similar in area to the one of Arboreus and Syndesia, since it is mostly covered by land. It’s a hot, arid world, plagued by a constant volcanic activity and scarce in edible resources.

Stone is common on Tartaros – sandstone, granite and obsidian in particular – and frequently used by demons to erect the buildings of their unholy cities. Metals besides iron are rare, but weapons made of the latter have already taken the life of thousands of creatures, in Tartaros and outside.

Due to the lack of water, agriculture is practically unfeasible on Tartaros, which forces demons to get most of their food by hunting the fearsome creatures that inhabit the planet. Whether demons would be interested in agriculture is doubtful anyway, considering patience is not exactly a virtue of theirs – if they have any virtue, that is.

Demons usually wear clothes made of leather crafted from the skin of their preys, since wild plants are also rare to come by – and when they can be found, they’re only suitable to be harvested for wood or hard fibers to make strings and ropes

@finland said in Feature Spotlight #6 - PvP, Alignment & Crime:

@phaethonas

I'm lolling. You want kill people not gathering. Otherwise you go on Arboreus to get your resources in 30mins. So stop talk about resources. Tartaros got resources too that are not on Arboreus and will be hard to get them for beastmen.

Remeber that you don't know how hard will be travel. 30 mins per day means: do I zerg? or do I try to gather few resources I may need?

No, actually I came to Fractured because I want to kill NPCs! If I want to go and kill people I will go to a pure pvp game, these are being made at the moment.

That said, it was evident from day 1 that care bears wanted pvpers to be marked as the bad guys who only want to gank people. Well, that is untrue. A pvper can't have much fun by ganking easy targets, pvpers want challenges.

The care bears got what they wanted, pvers to be marked as the "bad guys" and have a very hard time at Arboreus. The irony of that (I LOVE IRONY!) is that by doing so two things happened;

1. The pvpers now have a great challenge in their hands and it is called "Arboreus invasions". As I said, that incentivises pvpers to go and invade Arboreus en masse because we (pvpers) love challenges.

2. The economy gets unbalanced. No matter how many times you say it, the facts remains facts. And the fact is that 30 minutes are not enough for me to go and gather mats. Remember, I will be in an unknown area, where I will have to tackle both debuffs and the "wild life"/NPCs, where I won't know where the harvesting nodes or however you wanna call them are, and to actually gather the material (e.g. chop wood). That is literally impossible. As such players will band together in order to tackle the challenging mechanics the game will offer to them.

@finland said in Feature Spotlight #6 - PvP, Alignment & Crime:

@phaethonas I don't care about economy, I just care to kill stuff for example.

The irony of that comment is over 9000!

I, the "ganker", "the pvper who wants to ruin everyone game", care about the economy (and as such the game's success) and the defender of the care bears (Finland) cares only for killing stuff!!

Oh the irony! I adore irony.

@jetah said in Feature Spotlight #6 - PvP, Alignment & Crime:

@phaethonas Can I vote to called the Demonic Alliance?

Sure, I am always open to democracy. That said, I suggested the term "Unholy Alliance" cause it would include evil humans and even abominations as well.

So all of Tartaros will be the "Demonic Alliance" and the Demonic Alliance will have allies from other races (see evil humans and abominations) which will form the "Unholy Alliance".

@jetah said in Cosmetic cash shop, RMT and p2w.:

@phaethonas

P2W definition has changed but still being accepted from any cash shop to paywalls to top gear in the store. The other form is if it takes more time to acquire the item than is reasonable is p2w. Different generations of gamers have different definitions of p2w. It’s mostly what the person is willing to accept. Some will say any form of trading can be p2w because there’ll always be a means to use cash to obtain something. Even some games without trading can have account services being sold.

As I said, subjectively the majority of MMO players, consider RMT + player driven economy p2w. You want to add "at 2018"? I can accept that. I don't know what was going on at 2000, I do know what is happening now. I can't possibly know what will happen at 2028, I do know what is happening today.

Various, different polls, at different sites, prove what I am saying. Neither poll is absolutely correct at how it puts the question, but taken together, we can tell that today's MMO community doesn't like RMT.

@gibbx said in Feature Spotlight #6 - PvP, Alignment & Crime:

@phaethonas oki here is an example of the worst kind of gamer. you have a whole planet devoted to PVP. why do you feel you have to take PVP to a PVE planet and ruin the gamers playing experience there?

Why? Did you miss the memo in which it was clearly stated that each planet will have unique resources?

Why? Well, because I can.

If the devs want Arboreus protected at all times, then they should simply make a game like that and they should not make a mechanic which will allow invasions/travelling. In that case though they have to forget about their resources/economy plans as well.

How many times must I say this; You can't please everyone, you can't do everything.

If you want each planet to have its unique economy system, then in order for the overall economy not to be imbalanced you need the travelling mechanic. But as each planet is organized according to its rule-set, you will have people with different playstyles interacting. As a pvper I can compromise, to a degree, and have my life be difficult at the peaceful/pve planet. What is this degree? As long as the economy works.

The first thing I said was that 30 minutes are not enough. Are not enough for me to go, find the resources I need, gather them and leave. You know what this means? This means that I will seek help. And instead of a raging demon, you end up having a group of us.

Wanna know a fun fact? I don't need Fractured to be a pvp game. My "Unicorn" pvp game is Camelot Unchained. Having found that, I am seeking another game for my "pve tendencies". So, initially I wanted to play a beastman and maybe make a defense force. Proof of that is that my initial "hero" was a beastman. Now it is a demon. Now, I am more interested into being a demon. My idea of the "Unholy Alliance" intrigues me. Now, I want to make this "Unholy Alliance" because it seems that the demons are drawing the short stick. They get the poor planet and they can't even be for more than 30 minutes in the rich planet.

So, choose;

You can't have it all, I can't have it all, the devs can't have it all.

PS

Lady Luck smiles at the "Unholy Alliance". This is the 66th post and the thread has 666 views!

@finland said in Feature Spotlight #6 - PvP, Alignment & Crime:

@phaethonas you are missing two things:

• evil alignments will be debuffed
• every mob/npc will attack evil alignments

So you have to care about mobs not only players who will defend the land (like me).
@Prometheus I hope that mobs/npc will scale up to avoid grouping/zerghing them down. So every player partecipating to attack/kill it (this means attacks, assists, heals) will scale that mob npc (gaining more hp and damage).

Why would you be at Arboreus defending the land? Didn't you say that you would be at the human planet?

Regardless, the "Unholy Legion" will attack in waves one after the other. The NPC mobs will be easy to be dealt with and debuffs will be a nuisance, but when wave after wave demons and evil humans will be attacking Arboreus, the beastmen will be running and will be trying to hide.

And I will say again; The harder you make it for evil aligned players (and specifically demons) to make it at Arboreus the worse it will be for the game.

Not only the devs will have teased players with FFA pvp at Arboreus, only for it to be taken it from them, but more importantly, the resources of Arboreus will be unavailable to demons. Evil humans will find the Arboreus materials at their planet, brought there from "good" humans, but as good demons will be rare (because who makes a demon to be good, let alone the difficulty of making a good demon) the demon planet will be devoid of Arboreus materials. This will create an imbalance at the economy and that is something you don't want.

In the end of the day the devs are trying to please everyone, and as I have said so many times, that is impossible. Literally impossible. Everyone needs to make compromises. The pvpers, the pvers, the devs. Otherwise the game will simply fail.

@finland said in Cosmetic cash shop, RMT and p2w.:

@phaethonas said in Cosmetic cash shop, RMT and p2w.:

Now, the solution is simple; Make cosmetics bind on pickup.

lol if thy do that all cosmetic things bougth via shop should not be lootable. I still don't care about RMT I alway find lots of people buying accounts to get more money. You will never solve that problem.

Why would the cosmetics be lootable?

@evolgrinz said in Suggestion: Just something I always wanted. Name my sword!:

Looking at the history of people having the power to name things online... not a good idea.
You will get names like 'Stabby McStabber' or '8r04dsw0rd' or insulting and other inappropriate names.

That would be a problem if the crafter could name the sword and the user (me) couldn't.

If I was the one who could name my sword, or if the crafter could name the sword and I could rename it, then I see no problem with names like; "8r04dsw0rd" or even "insulting and inappropriate names".

I named my sword "Anal Penetration", you won't even know that.

@Prometheus

A Temple Offering is a monetary donation that can be performed once a day in the home of one of the Gods of Fractured.

are we talking about real money/Dynamight Gold here or in-game currency?

Even worse, you are only allowed to stay on Arboreus for half an hour at once, and you are quickly drained of all vital energies if you step into a Good-only area.

First of all I find the 30 minutes restriction too much. More importantly though, here are some questions; OK after 30 minutes I am kicked out, how long till I am able to return? Do I have a debuff not allowing me to return, or I may start preparations returning immediately. When first going to Arboreus, where do I land? When I am kicked out and then return (whether this is after 1 hour or 24 hours) where do I return to? Will I return to the area I was kicked out from?

If you’re Evil and looking to travel to Arboreus to go on a killing spree, you won’t succeed

Are you sure about that?

I can already see ways for my demon horde to bring death and destruction at Arboreus. Sure it will require some real planning and team work, but that challenge is very much welcome

For example;

1. I have some members of my guild to achieve neutral alignment (neutral demons have been confirmed). Then I send those ahead of the rest of us. They go and put themselves into key positions of the planet and then....

2. Evil aligned demons enter Arboreus and start killing and destroying. Sure after 30 minutes those will be kicked out but then.....

3. the second wave of evil demons will enter and then the third and the fourth and the fifth, all the while group 1 of the neutral demons will turn "aggresive", then group 2, then group 3.

4. Let's assume that I was in the first wave. Depending how easy and "fast" it is to go to Arboreus and whether I will have a debuff or not, I may return.

5. Depending the size of my guild or even the alliance of guilds that I am at, demons may have Arboreus at constant siege.

Yes, it requires planning and co-ordination, yes, I won't be there but for a measly 30 minutes, but my presence will be felt for days.

To put it simply; I am willing to bet that the aforementioned strong deterrents will create large and strong demon alliances with sole purpose of bypassing these deterrents. We PvPers will enjoy to play the cat and mouse game with the devs, finding legal ways to make our presence felt.

And now enter evil humans. I will contact large evil human alliances/guild and we will schedule attacks at Arboreus. 01:00 - 04:00 AM I will be sending 8 waves of demons. 04:00 - 08:00 AM the humans will be invading. And thus it is clear that Arboreus is far from safe.

Even if we will have a debuff for 30 days that will not allow us to travel to Arboreus, all "evil" players will band together once per month in order to bring chaos to Arboreus for hours, maybe even days, depending how many "evil" demons and humans are in this "unholy alliance". And be absolutely certain, this "unholy alliance" has just been made, regardless if I play the game or not.

If indeed your goal is to make Arboreus safe, you have only one way to go. Don't allow travel to it for evil and even neutral aligned characters. That of course should be accompanied with Arboreus not having unique resources, in order not to imbalance the economy.

All things considered though (that you want each planet to have unique resources, that you want Arboreus rather safe etc) I'd suggest lowering the deterrents towards the individual player. The more you are trying to stop the individual player to go, explore, Krash Kill N' Destroy, the more these individuals will want to do so and they will try to circumvent your deterrent systems by banding together.

You know what will stop demons from entering Arboreus and wreaking havoc? In-fighting. As long as you won't give the players who want to play in a FFA environment a reason to band together, they won't, and as such they won't be able to do much harm, cause most of the action will be at Tartaros. If you incentivise us to band together, then you will have the opposite effect.

@finland said in Cosmetic cash shop, RMT and p2w.:

Another thread about p2w issues. And again that's not pay to win. p2w is when you can buy powerfull equips that are not aviable in the game (or extremly rare like 0,01 chance). Cosmetic does not give any advantage. About shop money to exchange we discussed about it already

Pay attention, no-one said that cosmetic items give an advantage per se. The thread is not against cosmetics, the thread is against RMT.

Whether you use cosmetics or a sub token or whatever to achieve RMT is irrelevant. The point is that;

• RMT + player driven economy = p2w.

Whether you say "this" or "that", it doesn't matter. Objectively it is at least the same as buying a sword with stats from the cash shop. Actually it is worse (see above comments). Subjectively, the majority of MMO players consider RMT p2w, as expressed via numerous polls at various sources, a MassivelyOP poll that was conducted lately among others.

Now, the solution is simple; Make cosmetics bind on pickup.

This way you won't have RMT.

@evolgrinz said in Cosmetic cash shop, RMT and p2w.:

P2W means that there are items in the cash shop that are better than you can find in-game and the only way to get them is to pay real money.

Not really.

This may be your definition of p2w but it is neither an objective definition neither it is accepted by most MMO players.

Objectively what you consider p2w can be seen as;

• Real money --> gear with stats (from cash shop)

In a game with a player driven economy and RMT you will have;

• Real money --> [something, e.g. cosmetics] --> in-game currency --> gear with stats (crafted from a player).

In the end in both cases you have;

• Real money --> ([....]) --> gear with stats

If anything the RMT + player driven combo is more p2w, because when the gear with stats comes from the cash shop there is an infinite supply of such gear. When you have the RMT + player driven economy combo though, you have a finite supply of gear. That means that a whale (or a guild) can remove all best gear from the game just because they opened their wallet, which means that you won't be able to;

"get the same item without having to pay any real money", as a matter of fact, you won't be able to get the same item at all.

@jetah said in Cosmetic cash shop, RMT and p2w.:

I don't consider 3rd party p2w because it's beyond the developers control,

Who is 1st party, who is 2nd party and who is 3rd party?

In my view, 1st party = developers, 2nd party = players, 3rd party = gold sellers.

I don't consider any exploitation by gold sellers p2w either, but what I am describing doesn't involve a third party, it involves the developers and the players.

So, yeah, it is p2w.

While discussing about another game, I just realized that a cosmetic cash shop may lead to p2w. Sure that may seem weird for the most of you so please bear with me.

SWTOR (which I have played for 3 years) has a cash shop which has; a) cosmetic items and b) items used by non subscribers, such as raid passes and the like. So, SWTOR's cash shop per se is not p2w. As most of these cosmetic items are behind an RNG wall (aka lootboxes), some are very popular and rare and as such cost a lot of in-game currency. As such a person who spends a lot of real money into these cosmetic items may make a fortune of in-game currency. And here comes the tricky part.

SWTOR doesn't have a player driven economy, or in other words, the best gear comes from the game either as loot (directly) or through tokens and the like. As such the cash shop doesn't have p2w "implications" either. But what would have happened if SWTOR had a player driven economy and the best gear was coming from the players/crafters?

In that case we would have the following paradigm;

• Real money --> [...] --> in-game currency --> gear with stats.

When you start with "Real money" and you end up with "gear with stats", regardless how many stages you have gone through, you end up having p2w.

Sure, a number of assumptions have been made and things are more complex, but none of these assumptions or complexities will change the end result of the game ending being p2w. It may be "more" or "less" p2w or p2w in "this" case and not in "that" case, but it will be p2w.

So, is a purely cosmetic cash shop always p2w? NO!

It isn't the cosmetic cash shop per se, neither is a sub token (see EVE's PLEX) per se p2w, what is p2w is the combination of;

• RMT + player driven economy

To put it simply, if the cosmetic items of the cash shop can be traded in the game you have RMT, if you don't allow these cosmetic cash shop items to be traded in-game you won't have RMT.

No RMT means no p2w.

And here comes a very important question;

Will it be possible to trade in-game Fractured's cosmetic items or not?

When I first played SWTOR (like 4 years ago) I thought that this was the norm, but now I know that this isn't the case.

So, I think it would be really cool to have that option.

I am unsure if the crafter or the user should name the weapons, but regardless I find this interesting.

Daily post

@finland said in Ingame Arenas In Example Boxing:

@phaethonas it's hilarious the way you are arguing good points.

Not really.

They are neither "good points", nor the fact that you have [any] points undoes the fact that you don't really like Fractured (an open world game) which you want to change for [whatever] reason.

The devs are aware what games exist and what games are successful and have made the choice to make an open world game, which probably won't have instanced pve, let alone instanced pvp which is what we are talking about here.

So, you wanting to change a game so significantly, means that you don't like the game and that you don't think that it will succeed as it is.

So that brings the question; why are you here?

I'd suggest to you Ashes of Creation. It follows your way of thinking and it will have everything; instanced pve and pvp, open world pve and pvp, it will have sieges that you want to play etc etc.

I have to warn you though that I sincerely think that AoC is a vaporware/money grab. But that aside, it is the game which you are trying to convince the Fractured devs to make.

@finland said in Ingame Arenas In Example Boxing:

@phaethonas that's not a change but an extra. And hilarious is trying to suggest things to make a dead game. My suggestion will bring more players tho

Adding "extras" upon "extras" is changing the game the devs have envisioned! So, yeah, you want to change the game, and that is hilarious.

@finland said in Ingame Arenas In Example Boxing:

@phaethonas said in Ingame Arenas In Example Boxing:

as far as I know there will be no instanced pvp.

Well that's rigth but I hope to see at least arena (2v2, 3v3, 5v5, 10v10). Also dreaming on instanced pvp like 15v15, 20v20, 60v60.

lol, once more you want to change core features of the game! Hilarious!!

@finland said in Ingame Arenas In Example Boxing:

@phaethonas if the "fake money" can't be bought I don't see problems. Loot box can be bought with real money in many games or with a shoppable currency. Kinda different from burning gold (dunno the name of the fractured currency) tha you can only gather by playing.

You can't see the problem, that doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

A problem is that even with fake money it promotes a certain behavior. That along side the fact that there is talk about outright banning lootboxes creates another problem; Bad PR