Posts made by Pluto

@Canterbury

You got me incorrectly. The Kickstarter was extremely influential. It’s a proof of concept to show your benefactors the viability of the product. Yes, further funding will continually increase the benefactors interest I’m sure. But having a cash grab that shoves it in the face of your earlier backers isn’t the best way to do it.

The sale was irrelevant, are you able to say that these funds wouldn’t be raised without the sale itself? As you state it’s so itty bitty tiny, apparently it’s irrelevant. Ergo, no need for sale. The simple fact that the packs were ending was enough of a spur to get people to back.

@Jetah
Of course, but external funding isn't one and done. It's a constant discussion with your benefactor.

It's the same thing with any project. You pitch an idea, they front some money. You have a prototype, oh... that gets some interest. You show potential return on investments... now THAT gets some interest.

Obviously I don't know specifics, but I think it's rather naive to think the Kickstarter didn't impact external funding

@Canterbury

Of course, I don't know the entirety of their financials. However, the process usually involves trying to find funding outside of crowdfunding. In order to secure that funding, it is important to show interest in the game. (Kickstarter). That's usually how the process has worked.

If they had just slaved away in their offices, I kind of doubt their current prototype would have accrued the funding they are currently at. So yes, the Kickstarter has helped the process I'm sure. Hmm... who's missing the big picture now? You honestly don't have to be a game developer to understand that process. It's the same with ANY project. You need to show the need and potential return before your client is going to put down the dough.

I'll just ignore all those other personal attacks.

Edit:
I also find it interesting that all the love for the process is coming from those benefiting from it

@Greenfox

I think you misread my post, or I put it poorly. CIG is the one with shady cash grabs as well. Which is why I equate this current situation to them.

Edit:
Re-reading my comments, it appears I am slightly more than just perturbed haha.

@Jetah

I don’t, I’m actually fine with both those options. They could even put all of the Kickstarter items on the cash shop. As long as it is done with equality in mind.

I’m not a “oh, I backed on the Kickstarter so I want exclusive stuff only for me” type of person. I do believe that a Kickstarter, or crowdfunding campaign, should not allow for cheaper acquisitions of the items found in the Kickstarter. More expensive? That’s their prerogative, but cheaper? No.

As for post release items, they can do sales and anything they deem necessary. Heck, if I buy a cosmetic for $10 and it goes half off the next day? No big deal. But on crowdfunded items? Hard no from me. Could the sale bring them down to the price of the KS? Of course! Just not under.

@Greenfox

Both projects have had cash grabs, which is why I equate them. Development blunders on the SC side could be considered shady, but they were largely brought about through absolutely poor planning. Literally the worst I’ve seen in a long time.

@Greenfox

They have more of my trust than Dynamight. They’ve done some shady stuff of course, but it’s somewhat on the right track.

@Jetah

Nah, I’m still interested in fractured. I just can’t trust putting more down on it. I suppose they have my funds, but it is a slight regret at the moment.

There are also many projects out there I am interested in. Oath, dual universe, even star citizen has more faith at the moment. All of which receive my continuing backing. It may not mean much, as I am one person... but it does add up over time.

Anyhow, unless there are real arguments out there... you guys have a good one.

@Jetah said in Pledge Packs Are Going... With A Sale!:

@Pluto

DS has limited funds and they need more.

Hmmm.

Cash grab with some lipstick plastered on the pig is still a cash grab.

@Greenfox

I’ve already addressed that. I’ll just take my leave at this point. But once again, they lost my faith.

@Greenfox

So let’s shaft the larger backers. Great idea.

@Jetah

I think you need to re-read my post, I addressed that.

As for the cash grab, what else is it?

@Greenfox

Wrong again. 850 aristocrat KS. 750 sale price.

Once again, I don’t care about free fluff. And I’m pretty sure post KS packs are logged as KS backers anyhow

@Canterbury said in Pledge Packs Are Going... With A Sale!:

@Pluto said in Pledge Packs Are Going... With A Sale!:

The money isn't an issue for me, it's the idea of it. I obviously put money forward for a vision, but it's tactics like these that I absolutely abhor. Such a shame, I suppose a company can't be perfect.

Without trying to start a fight here, let's call it like it is. People putting down money now, for a slightly discounted price (and it's only slightly, let's not forget), are still putting down money for a vision, exactly the same as you. The game is still aaaaaages away.

Slightly? I could have saved 100 euros. But once again, the $ is irrelevant. Well, it’s relevant in the sense that I won’t be putting another dime down on this game. Which I also understand is irrelevant, there are plenty to replace me.

It's not like people who put down the money at KS are some incredible early adopters and anyone who comes along now has some sort of red carpet rolled out for them.

Right. But you also don’t expect us to roll out the red carpet for new adopters either. Everyone should be equal.

As far as I can see, someone stumping up $$$ now is in no better (or worse) position than someone who did it at KS.

Wrong. You are significantly better off backing now versus the KS. Without the KS, they wouldn’t be at the position that they are.

The fact of the matter is they broke good faith. End of story. The packs are legitimately cheaper than they were on the Kickstarter. Bad faith.

You may be okay with it, but such tactics do not sit well with me. What’s next? Right?

@Specter

You missed my point, I was saying if you followed the target model, that’s how it would work.

The sale is still scummy no matter how you slice it

@Jetah

That really isn’t comparable, at all haha. These aren’t physical items that have been on sale for awhile. The thing about physical merchant sales is the fact that things have been iterated on, and newer, better items become available. Thus, the old items get marked down to get them moved. If Dynamight followed that model, I’d be EXTREMELY worried, not just slightly perturbed.

If I need to clarify, this would be like Dynamight creating newer, better packs than those from the Kickstarter and then knocking down the prices for the Kickstarter packs permanently, until they are sold out. However, the Kickstarter packs are digital so they can’t sell out... might as well leave them up forever, eh?

Steam has a similar problem, minus the physicality of the item of course. Steams has production/released games. Bringing up early access isn’t valid either, that’s still “release” in my book.

And the most important factor? Neither steam nor target are crowdfunded sources. We (or I) backed the Kickstarter in full confidence that I would be treated fairly and newcomers would not be given a better deal that I cannot take advantage of for my tier.

@Bailey
It really is, I’m pretty used to these cash grab tactics from developers by now. The two that hurt me the most is star citizen, and now fractured. I’m still interested in both games, but... it’s different after something like this. Thankfully novaquark has held true so far with dual universe, there is yet hope!

Although not too perturbed, I do have to wonder who thought this was a fair idea whatsoever. Seems rather strange that putting money up front, where the project had less of a foundation.... bah, I won't even go into it.

I just hope it's not foreshadowing of similar tactics to come.

To clarify:
The money isn't an issue for me, it's the idea of it. I obviously put money forward for a vision, but it's tactics like these that I absolutely abhor. Such a shame, I suppose a company can't be perfect.

@Jetah

I haven't read the entirety of this thread, but I have to 100% agree. Now is NOT the time for marketing. DS has both our kickstarter money, as well as traditional external funding.

Marketing should never happen 2+ years before release. Are there passionate gamers? Yes. Are they the majority? No. Most gamers would lose interest before release. Therefore, you are wasting marketing on a demographic that you're inherently going to lose. You might get a few oddball passionate players, but it's likely they're already actively searching for a game like this... and probably found it.

In any case, the goal should be to "ensnare" as many players as you can, just before release.

When I talk about marketing, I primarily mean a dedicated push to reach as many gamers as possible. However, I do think it's important to release videos and devblogs about the state of the game, of course

*PS:
I hate using the term DS, it reminds me of Derek Smart. dryheaves

But... why? lol

For immersion, when you look outside do you see a bunch of people running around with their chickens and clams hanging out? I don't... I'm pretty happy with their decision on this one haha

YYeewww. Congrats!